Ted Wong mówi o Jeet Kune Do- video

... and no ability to move as a movement?
Don't strain yourself too much, man.

Michal, lost my point again. I said "that he solely in Poland knows, what it really is all about." which means that you claimed to be following the only real way of JKD, and doing whatever in your power to take us, tribal savages, out of dark caves of our misunderstanding of martial arts. Admit it, as I'm lazy enough today not to show you proofs, which are present. Moreover, you really don't have to "praise the word", agreeing to everything Stefan writes here, be it a word or a dot. Unless you want to crawl up his... well, whatever.

The same way the video clips shown to us by Michal (ones with your tutorial Stefan) do not in the slightest represent your true potential, our demo videos are targeted to draw attention. One, who would suggest that marketing in martial arts is a bad thing is simply a lunatic. We have to show marvelous movement to be recognised, in order to have students to show them something "a little" different, the true thing. Simple as that.
Therefore a statement that Michal's opinion is based on our demos is, sorry to put it straight, dumb.

I once again want to state, that should you visit us, you would find many similarities in our, different by the name, ways. Your words Stefan, that one has to know the basis of JKD before starting to adapt it to his needs, are 100% right. Only you, as I take it, think, that we do not learn those basis. Maybe it is true for some Polish schools, but not as general. We (in Robert Karpinski's Warrior Academy of Martial Arts) know of on-guard stance, which we apply during the trainings. I bet the same is in W.A'a school.
The difference is, we use it both sides.

One thing bugs me. How would you explain the fact that Bruce used daun-tek, when it can be used with the rear foot as well?

If you could point out some differences between what you know, and what you think we know - we could discuss those more.

That's the whole Stefan, constantly pushing himself to overcome the limits of the body.



Merkavorth- C'mon man...Every post you wrote and I replied to it you were saying: "You missundertood me" etc. Yes there are a proofs where I was saying that Ted Wong spent most hours with Bruce Lee, there are a proof where you said that Lind Lee's words and Ted Wongs as well are worthless, You also said that Ted Wong was "honoured" by Inosanto... Every time I asked you to explain why do you think that way and not other, giving you my arguments... I also said that every one can does what he likes, but why to call this "what je likes" JKD, I said that Inosanto approach is considering JKD as a mix of 27 martial arts, which I clearly said in the book of your idol Ron Balicki. At that time you said that JKD is not a mix and on the other time you said that there is no proof that JKD isn't a mix of 27 martial arts. When I gave you an examples quoting an explanation of what is JKD from BLEF website, then you sit quiet.

As far as the video clips, when someone puts a video and name it demo of the school then I quess he is aware that the opinion about what he teach in his school is based on this video. As a matter of fact the moves in that video wasn't very "spectacular" as you say- I quess this was from some kind of demo in public and from trainings. And as for giving 100% in the movie, wasn't you the one who was constanly saying that Ted Wong in the video that I have posted didn't show anything special. What's more that video purpose wasn't for promotion the JKD that Ted Wong teach it was made by his niece for the school project

Going back to Inosanto approach, when the man who is main representant and even founder of JKD concepts says that JKD consist of 27 diiferent MA, and you seemed to represent Inosanto approach and you say that JKD isn't the mixture of 27 MA then I assume that you might know at well what you are training.

As far as agreeing with Stefan every word, I agree with his words note becouse "I want to crawl in his..." as you said but becouse I percieve JKD in very similar way as he does.

I dare to say that you are the one who is trying toadyisming to him. As you was accusing Ted Wong, Stefan and me as well of being too much narrow minded, too much sticking to Bruce Lee idea and trying to make a crystilized style from JKD.- there are also present proofs of that. Now when Stefan appeard all of sudden your " JKD narrow minded men" attitude is directed only toward me. How strange....This tells me about the methods that you follow to put your in good light by any mean and to like Stefan said, becouse you may be afraid of loosing the "dominative" position.

I was opened to everyone and in some of post I said that it would be great if people interested in training JFJKD can contact me.

Going back again to proofs what I said was that Ted Wong is teaching only the material/techniques which he was thought directly and personally from Bruce Lee, why the thing that JKD which is being thought by Inosanto deviates from Bruce Lee's original teachings and principles, so I dared to claim that "This is not Bruce Lee's art anymore". What's more I dared to claim " That JKD concepts is the comercialized version of JKD"- Where I didn't get in from nowhere.

Merkavorth, please stop hiding your claims by telling simply "Ah Michal you misunderstood me again" or " Michal you jump in too much conclusions again". And please stop treating me as your enemy and that I am furiously attacking you with my posts just to show yourself from better side than it was.


By the way in the following week or two I will put video from my visit at Stefan place.




Sincerely,

Michal



Zmieniony przez - MichalJF w dniu 2008-11-07 19:01:10

The new painkiler worked magic, It was a long time ago when I had such a wonderful time kickick the heavy bag.

Intresting Clip by the "specific" dan inosanto On Guard on the Clip you posted. I must say that his stance is so different from ted Wong that it is scary. Why not put a sign on the Forehaead that says "kick me in the groin". To ted Wong, protecting the groin is one of the main things he was taught by Bruce. Another thing that I can put my money on is that scientifically this open groin stance to Ted Wongs Triangle stance is 100 times more stable in its Posture . Rememebr Broce Lee´s qoute "Postures in relaying Force.

I am so confident in this statement that I will take up any bet that says differently. If you arrange a seminar I will tak up this bet with anyone.

Please, I am not saying that Ted´s is better, I am only saying that I am confident in the scientific principles Bruce Lee laid down for JKD is quite secientifaccly easy prooved my doing Ted Wong JKD, as you who prefer this stance showed are and should be just as confident as me to take this bet, and just wait for a seminar to see who is closer to the ultimate truth. In other words, which is more Stable and follow the "posture in relaiyng Force" Concepts of JKD. If you like the Stance demonstrated it is okey, I am only saying that everybody should consider and at least compare it with something else presented, everybode should put their own beliefs to the test, as I do and everybody who studeies Jun fan JKD. I hope that Concepts people have the same ambition..

I am really looking forward to some day visiting Poland and personally sharing the knowledge , Bruce personally shared with ted Wong and Ted Wong has privately shared with me. This would be the perfect setting to share some insight in JKD with each other. Not saying that this is better than that, simply presenting what we do and why, asking and answering questions from wach other.

Still no quotes to discuss, does that mean I get to choose one of my favourites and then expect a answer from those who have some knowledge to share about their understanding of Bruce Lee and the meaning of his quotes.

I am starting to get the feeling that someene mentioned things without being able to back it up with some facts, but I might be wrong. Therefore I will wait for a few more days before I start to back my statements with facts, videoclips or whatever people might ask me. I hope that people will share my entusiasm and join the discussion that someone else than me started. At least I will end the discussion, no matter what others will respond to my request and what a certain man who made the statements about quotes will do, and started this whole discussion about quotes.

/SteFan

I've got a question concering some of the training methods used in your JKD. Do you teach/practice chi sao???


Zmieniony przez - cordx w dniu 2008-11-07 19:56:38

This is the last time when I will be writing on who said what and what I think about it.

My opinion is that JKD concepts guys harshly attacks on me after I posted Ted Wong video proves that they felt that in their opinnion the only way "JKD concepts" was put on doubt.

From now on let's talk about JKD, maybe comparison between the JFJKD and JKD concepts etc. Anyway it would be great if there were created a tottaly new section room for JKD discussion and not putting them into MMA as JKD is not MMA.

It would be great to organize something like coordinated seminar. I am in!


I was up to organize Stefan Nikander seminar a long time ago it would be truly a dream come true.
I am on a good way to organize the seminar with Stefan Nikander in Poland. Stefan accepted the invitation long time ago and It would have succeed long time ago but becouse of "technical" problems I had to postpone it. Hopefully right now more and more people will be interested in Ted Wong approach toward JKD and "technical" problems won't come around again or it will be much more easier to overcome them.



Michal

Zmieniony przez - MichalJF w dniu 2008-11-07 21:01:03

Zmieniony przez - MichalJF w dniu 2008-11-07 22:15:44

Michail,
I am just back from this mornings "Martial arts Aeorobic" session. I was kicking lie never before, and without any severe pain.

I am so motivated now that I will go doenstairs and train for a couple of hours, Then I will answer some statements made and requests asked on the Forum

I will just say one thing. Please don´t stop writing about your oppinion. I have been there and it is exactly what they want. To me this happened both in Sweden and Norway. I got so tired about all the s_ _ t that was thrown at me beacuse of my alternative approacjh to JKD that I simply gave up, decided to simply concentrate on my own training.

What happened, no more discussions about JKD, everything was quiet on the JKD Forum, Everthing was well in their Kingdom and things went on like before. This did not benefit JKD, at least not "both of the sides of the coin" attitude I was fighting for. I realized that this was exactly what they wanted, they didn´t want their empire disturbed.They didn´t want that people started considering that there IS another side of the coin, another point of view, another way to go in JKD.

I got back on track, and I will never back down again, not for me, not for Ted, nor for Bruce, but for JKD. So please Michail, don´t let them get to you, it is exactly what they want, for you to leave them alone. You are not alone, I will support you the best I can since we share point of view. Hopefully more and more will have the courage to stand up against the common belief, knowing that they will have support from at least two people when THEY get harassed from the mayority on Forum.

"You throw a pepple into a poung and you get ripples, soon the ripples will spread over the whole pound". You threw the pepple in Poland, the ripples will spread, just be patient, trust in yourself.

What others think of you is not as important than what you KNOW about yourself. I have such a selfknowledge that i finally can take all thes s_ _t I get and fight for my side of the couin when it comes to JKD.

Be well my friend, my JKd brother

/SteFan

Stefan,
Im curious to see the clip you described earlier. It is really hard to compare anything you do not see with what you were learned.
Concerning the on-guard stance, I personally think that due to difference in people, every one person has its own. At least I forego many tests every time a new technique is shown to me, be it stance or a kick, or what have you.
Ultimately everything I do is adapted to my preferences, and the adaptation process involves hundreds of repetitions.

You said earlier that a common saying that "Practice makes perfect" isn't true in whole, because if you do something wrong on and on, "you are perfect in doing something wrong". I agree, yet I must point out that your statement only applies to people who are close-minded. If you do something wrong repetitively and you make use of brains, you eventually realise what was wrong and fix it up. To me it is part of the essence of JKD.


Michal,
it wasn't me who said about 27 arts combined, I had read such thing for the first time in my life here. It wasn't me who said Stefan's demo was a poor MMA. My point is you treat everyone here overally, and it is, as an opponent. Change that and we will speak.

And you too, please describe what demo of us you saw, where and when, as I am not able to speak of something I'm not aware of.
Apart from that, you again didn't get my point at all. You just might be not aware of some market princ-i-p-a-ls, so let's just make it clear:
Demos with more spectaculars than essence are for show, in order to draw people to the lessons. THERE, over time they are being taught the essence. This IS a marketing princ-i-p-al, and it DOES work.

I again invite you to our trainings. I don't know where do you live, as you still remain an anonym, but please, cease to grade people by dim proofs, and get some proper ones.

Zmieniony przez - Merkavoth w dniu 2008-11-08 12:51:41

I won't give up I never will. I will not back down. I am very greatetful and thankful for the fact that I was able to meet you Stefan. The one with whom not only can I share my opinion on JKD but also about life. I am honoured to be your JKD brother.


I will be doing my best and I am thankful so much that you are supporting me. I know that this is just a matter of time when people start to be enough confident to look another way.


Your JKD brother and friend

Michal

Merkavoth, I see more and more similarities from country to country. When eveything fails you start asking for clips from me. Just write Stefan Nikander on You Tube and we have plenty of clips to discuss.

Take the Stance fo example. Go through my clips and you will see me standing in the Bruce lee described on Guard most of the times. When I do not stand in trhe Stance it is beacuause I have not yet reach the "No Form" and "No Style" of JKD. What differs me from you, and Jun fan from Concepts is that I say that I have not yet reached what i consider JKD when you see me performing something that is not what Bruce put as the root of jis JKf. You, anf Concepts go on saying that we all are different, that this difference makes however we stand and whatever we do as JKD.

Just pick any clip of me and post it on this Forum and I will give you an explanation why I say that what I am performing is JKD. What about you. Since you ask me of clips I assume that you have something to offer back. Do you have a clip on You Tube ehere yo display your JKD On Guard. Are you willing to show me a clip, explain me why it is JKD, and most of all be open to some critics.

"Put your money where your mouth is", don´t be like 99,9 % of the Concepts people I discuss. They promise clips, they ask me for clips, butt 99,) % of them never share a clip.

Why? Well yuo tell me. What would be the reasopn you are not sharing a clip. I have probably missed something you asked. I ill post this one, read your comments and be right back

/SteFan

"Practice makes Perfect" I must have made a huge mistake. I never say this, I always say

"Practice doesn´t make Perfect, Perfect Ptactice makes perfect"

By this I mean that if you practice the wrong things perfectly, you will be performing the wrong things perfectly. One example is if you look on You Tube on my Stick Fighting. You want see any Double Stick, you won´t se any abanicos and strange looking Kali striking. Why? I am always told that you train High kicks to better Low kicks, you train double sticks to enhace you empty hand or single stick.

No, to me its all about "Apples and oringis"- If I train Double Stick I will perfect Double Stick, If you Train high Kicks you will enhance high Kicking, you Train Muay Thai you enhance Muasy Thai, Kali, Silat, Grappling. If you Train JKD according to Bruce Lee writen guidelines AND FACTS, you will enhance JKD. I always say i I want to perfect what I train I train, apply everything from One Stance, from JKD point of view, I choose simple techniques etc, I don´t choose whatever suits me as JKD, if Kali, Muay Thai suits me I would call what suits me Kali or Muay Thai. But thats just me, and the Jun fan way of respecting every art, Kali and Muay Thai, as well as JKD and Bruce Lee. I guess that naming Kali JKD, or Gracie Juj Juutsu as bruce Lee ´s JKD is some peoples way of showing respect to Bruce lee and helio gracie.. Look at my clips on You Tube, do you see any fancy stuff. Yeas, Someone said that on one of my clips I did "Poor Grappling". They were so right, from JKD it was "Poor Grappling". If you would understand Swedish you would know that I was teaching traditional grappling I had been taught, what NOT TO Do in JKD Groundfighting.

I know I have many clips on Swedish, I would be glad to give you an translation of what and why something is being shown. I would of course espect you to have a clip that will show me anything you are commenting from you point of View.The reason you comment my point of view, what I am fdoing. That to me is respecting each other. If anyone says that my Grappling is imitating som medioker Grappling. I would take this comment very lightly if this person is not showing a videoclip how it is supposed to be done by his point of view, as a matter fact I would have very low oppinion about this persons own abilities without him giving as much as he is asking.

How is it, are you just out to critizice me, be a Internet "paper Tiger" like the 99,9% I have met in Norway, Sweden etc. Or are you "a man for your words", a true martial artsist.

/SteFan